does anyone know the guy who was or is trialing a tr 3 or what the shortcomings of this car are (for trialing) i am excepting it will be class 5 ,regards adrian
I remember the car but can't recolect the driver at the moment. I would think the main shortcomings would be Ground Clearance, Ground Clerance and Ground Clearance.
Hi Adrian, I have all the answers and if you are after details a phone call to me of an evening 7 -11pm on 01963 371417 is fine. In short there have been two TR3`s campaigned upon MCC events in the last 35 years. One by Phil Tucker, of Devon (an x member) for about 7 seasons and the other by myself for 12 seasons. I did get up all the hills with my car Litton,Bamford, Blue Hills,Simms etc but not all at the right time. Phils car did much better and with him driving, "we" took the Class 5 award upon one Exeter. Back in the 50`s I know that some TR owners entered the Lands End just to enjoy their drive down to Tregrehan Hill Climb upon Easter Sunday. So how easy were MCC events then ? TR3`s were quite common 35 years ago and my car cost £100. I am currently of the opinion that if you really want a cheap non competitive sports car the rubber bumpered MGB roadster could be fun.I am toying with entering the main Class for 2010 but have some issues with the car which may prevent me entering. Even as a Class O car it is not a walk in the park. If anyone is still with this, I have a second MGB roadster for sale cheap - ideal for a trailist with a mig. And what became of my trials TR ? It was photographed upon Fingle by "Motor Sport" and after appearing in their magazine someone recognised the registration as being an Ex works car. The car was subsequently rebuilt to its original condition
The pale blue TR3 seen regularly on classic trials in the early 90's was driven by Phil Tucker from Ippleden.
One of the main problems with these cars is the weakness of the front suspension mounting bolts, I've had our TR4A's o/s bottom bolt shear under heavy road braking! For comp use (race/rally) they have to be beefed up. I took the same precaution before we took our car over to Turkey. I'm pretty certain that Phil Tucker grafted on an entire GT6 front suspension setup in place of the original TR3 bits on his, I remember talking with him about it. That would have given him more strength, travel, and steering lock. The live axle TR's don't have much traction in slippery conditions either, once got my earlier TR4 stuck in the gutter outside my house after a moderate snowfall!
The other problem must be the weight of the engine, lots of torque and plenty of power (105bhp on standard SU's), but very heavy (Standard Vanguard/Triumph TR/Ferguson tractor, all the same basic engine block)
Still it would be nice to see a TR out trialling again.
Adrian have a chat with jonathan laver first [i remember his T R as a young lad spectating at Simms] Iam sure Jonathan has Phil Tuckers number, of course I have his number but don't want to publish it on internet without his permission. Phil and his brother Mike are accomplished engineers and have helped me many times with mods to the Anglia .I last spoke to Phil a few weeks ago and his is seriously considering re-building his trialing T R and competing in class 5 again, as you can imagine it will be re-built to a very high standard....It will be great to see more cars out in class 5 , make sure they are competitive because Keith Saunders Reliant climbs very well..........
Greg - You can send a personal mesage to Adrian accessible just to him. Click on his "Nickname" You will see the Personal message facility in the right column.
yes the ground clearance is a isue but carefull set of the rear spring to chassis set up and 15" wheels should be ok , weight could be the killer but as the engine is well back in the frame might be ok ,hopefully i will get some weights later today
Who is "Adrian" who originated this thread, and how much trials experience does he have? If the answer to the latter question is "little", then a vehicle like the TR is not going to be a suitable mount. The preparation required would not be for the faint hearted or inexperienced. Its interesting to note that Phil Tucker appears to have been obliged to fit an illegal front suspension to make his car work.
Adrian is Adrian Booth who has been with us quite a while. Not sure why this display name came up instead of user ID which is ren5turbo1.
Adrian trialled a Puegeot for a while and I think this is the car that James Shallcross now trials.
Just to mention guys and girls. If your display user ID isn't your real name it does help if you sign your posts with your real name. IMHO it is important to maintain real names here.
I think it would be super to see a TR out on the hills again so lets hope Adrian pursues this project. Can't help thinking it would be kinder to use it in class 0 though.
as i understand it you can use any suspention so long as you use the original pick up points ,how this is interpreted is open to debate if i took a sunbeam alpine the front x member (a very heavy item )is held on by 4 bolts which must be considerd the pick up points ,so a light frame with double whishbones and coilovers should be ok , not that i want to use this car or set up ,ps i have no intention of entering class o
Oh dear, I do hope that my recollection of Phil Tuckers TR3 suspension mods haven't got him into trouble. I'd hate to think that mentioning something like that could prevent him from bringing the car out onto the hills again. Actually the GT6 front suspension works on exactly the same coil spring and teledamper with top and bottom wishbones principle as the TR. I would think that the mounting positions on the chassis rail are also virtually in the same place. Does that comply with the technical requirements regarding suspension mounting points in the standard classes? What's really important for trialling is to see different cars being used, if that means some tech fudges to make those cars viable (rather than demon mods to make them ultra competitive) I would work on the Lord Nelson principle. Great to see the TR7 and Porsche 924 competing and lets not forget the Morgans and MGB's (special mention to Brian Osborne who has persevered with his 'B' for many years)
Phils TR3A was out upon section long before the new rule regarding suspension pick up points was introduced. The car was always a work in progress to try and get a TR into places it was never designed to go. Knowing how particular Phil is and as an Ex C of C for the Torbay he will be up to date with any rule changes should he get round to putting the car back on the road - so no worries. In short - a standard early TR can be a load of fun driven in Class "0". You are likly to sustain damage to the bottom of the rear wings and you will ripe of the standard exhaust system. A Tin medal was awarded to a TR3 upon L. E. 2003
In truth I tend to agree with Dave A's last paragraph, that it is more important to have a variety of entrants than worry too much about how the middle ranks make their cars work. Who was it that originally said "You can do anything you like so long as you don't win"?
Phil Tucker and I judge show cars together at the TR International. Why ? because we volunteered and now cannot find anyone else to do it. He is currently building a replica Triumph TR3S. This is the other extreme to “mud plugging”. The TR3S were built specifically to compete at Le Mans. He will be looking for an experienced driver with spare underpants to take it around at the Classic Le Mans, when it is finished. We have talked about his trials TR which is the next one on the blocks and should be out and about in 2011. It`s all coming out now - so I drink wine and whisky but not at the same time.
I remember the car but can't recolect the driver at the moment. I would think the main shortcomings would be Ground Clearance, Ground Clerance and Ground Clearance.
ReplyDeleteHi Adrian, I have all the answers and if you are after details a phone call to me of an evening 7 -11pm on 01963 371417 is fine. In short there have been two TR3`s campaigned upon MCC events in the last 35 years. One by Phil Tucker, of Devon (an x member) for about 7 seasons and the other by myself for 12 seasons. I did get up all the hills with my car Litton,Bamford, Blue Hills,Simms etc but not all at the right time. Phils car did much better and with him driving, "we" took the Class 5 award upon one Exeter. Back in the 50`s I know that some TR owners entered the Lands End just to enjoy their drive down to Tregrehan Hill Climb upon Easter Sunday. So how easy were MCC events then ? TR3`s were quite common 35 years ago and my car cost £100. I am currently of the opinion that if you really want a cheap non competitive sports car the rubber bumpered MGB roadster could be fun.I am toying with entering the main Class for 2010 but have some issues with the car which may prevent me entering. Even as a Class O car it is not a walk in the park. If anyone is still with this, I have a second MGB roadster for sale cheap - ideal for a trailist with a mig. And what became of my trials TR ? It was photographed upon Fingle by "Motor Sport" and after appearing in their magazine someone recognised the registration as being an Ex works car. The car was subsequently rebuilt to its original condition
ReplyDeleteDavid Alderson has emailed me to say:-
ReplyDeleteThe pale blue TR3 seen regularly on classic trials in the early 90's was driven by Phil Tucker from Ippleden.
One of the main problems with these cars is the weakness of the front suspension mounting bolts, I've had our TR4A's o/s bottom bolt shear under heavy road braking! For comp use (race/rally) they have to be beefed up. I took the same precaution before we took our car over to Turkey. I'm pretty certain that Phil Tucker grafted on an entire GT6 front suspension setup in place of the original TR3 bits on his, I remember talking with him about it. That would have given him more strength, travel, and steering lock. The live axle TR's don't have much traction in slippery conditions either, once got my earlier TR4 stuck in the gutter outside my house after a moderate snowfall!
The other problem must be the weight of the engine, lots of torque and plenty of power (105bhp on standard SU's), but very heavy (Standard Vanguard/Triumph TR/Ferguson tractor, all the same basic engine block)
Still it would be nice to see a TR out trialling again.
Adrian have a chat with jonathan laver first [i remember his T R as a young lad spectating at Simms] Iam sure Jonathan has Phil Tuckers number, of course I have his number but don't want to publish it on internet without his permission. Phil and his brother Mike are accomplished engineers and have helped me many times with mods to the Anglia .I last spoke to Phil a few weeks ago and his is seriously considering re-building his trialing T R and competing in class 5 again, as you can imagine it will be re-built to a very high standard....It will be great to see more cars out in class 5 , make sure they are competitive because Keith Saunders Reliant climbs very well..........
ReplyDeleteGreg - You can send a personal mesage to Adrian accessible just to him. Click on his "Nickname" You will see the Personal message facility in the right column.
ReplyDeleteMichael
Hi
ReplyDeleteI think it was Phil Tucker
MikeW
I se you have all beaten me to It ! - Still my TR 7 is running well in MCC events -cheaper then an MGB ;-) .......
ReplyDeleteyes the ground clearance is a isue but carefull set of the rear spring to chassis set up and 15" wheels should be ok , weight could be the killer but as the engine is well back in the frame might be ok ,hopefully i will get some weights later today
ReplyDeleteWho is "Adrian" who originated this thread, and how much trials experience does he have? If the answer to the latter question is "little", then a vehicle like the TR is not going to be a suitable mount. The preparation required would not be for the faint hearted or inexperienced.
ReplyDeleteIts interesting to note that Phil Tucker appears to have been obliged to fit an illegal front suspension to make his car work.
Adrian is Adrian Booth who has been with us quite a while. Not sure why this display name came up instead of user ID which is ren5turbo1.
ReplyDeleteAdrian trialled a Puegeot for a while and I think this is the car that James Shallcross now trials.
Just to mention guys and girls. If your display user ID isn't your real name it does help if you sign your posts with your real name. IMHO it is important to maintain real names here.
I think it would be super to see a TR out on the hills again so lets hope Adrian pursues this project. Can't help thinking it would be kinder to use it in class 0 though.
Michael
as i understand it you can use any suspention so long as you use the original pick up points ,how this is interpreted is open to debate if i took a sunbeam alpine the front x member (a very heavy item )is held on by 4 bolts which must be considerd the pick up points ,so a light frame with double whishbones and coilovers should be ok , not that i want to use this car or set up ,ps i have no intention of entering class o
ReplyDeleteOh dear, I do hope that my recollection of Phil Tuckers TR3 suspension mods haven't got him into trouble. I'd hate to think that mentioning something like that could prevent him from bringing the car out onto the hills again. Actually the GT6 front suspension works on exactly the same coil spring and teledamper with top and bottom wishbones principle as the TR. I would think that the mounting positions on the chassis rail are also virtually in the same place. Does that comply with the technical requirements regarding suspension mounting points in the standard classes?
ReplyDeleteWhat's really important for trialling is to see different cars being used, if that means some tech fudges to make those cars viable (rather than demon mods to make them ultra competitive) I would work on the Lord Nelson principle. Great to see the TR7 and Porsche 924 competing and lets not forget the Morgans and MGB's (special mention to Brian Osborne who has persevered with his 'B' for many years)
Phils TR3A was out upon section long before the new rule regarding suspension pick up points was introduced. The car was always a work in progress to try and get a TR into places it was never designed to go. Knowing how particular Phil is and as an Ex C of C for the Torbay he will be up to date with any rule changes should he get round to putting the car back on the road - so no worries. In short - a standard early TR can be a load of fun driven in Class "0". You are likly to sustain damage to the bottom of the rear wings and you will ripe of the standard exhaust system. A Tin medal was awarded to a TR3 upon L. E. 2003
ReplyDeleteIn truth I tend to agree with Dave A's last paragraph, that it is more important to have a variety of entrants than worry too much about how the middle ranks make their cars work.
ReplyDeleteWho was it that originally said "You can do anything you like so long as you don't win"?
Phil Tucker and I judge show cars together at the TR International. Why ? because we volunteered and now cannot find anyone else to do it. He is currently building a replica Triumph TR3S. This is the other extreme to “mud plugging”. The TR3S were built specifically to compete at Le Mans. He will be looking for an experienced driver with spare underpants to take it around at the Classic Le Mans, when it is finished. We have talked about his trials TR which is the next one on the blocks and should be out and about in 2011. It`s all coming out now - so I drink wine and whisky but not at the same time.
ReplyDelete