I think the car on the left of the picture is the ex works Cream Cracker MG and the driver and owner is C.A.N May. The car in the middle is a P type MG, reg number MJ 9898?, and the driver is Dickie Green. Is the car on the right one of the NE Musketeers? When and where I don't know, by the sea maybe?
Jon - The car in the middle is indeed Dickie Green's MG PB MJ 9898. This car was supercharged with a Marshall 75 Blower and according to my research did over 100 events and "apart from the accepted trials breakages such as half shafts, differentials, etc., was superb". Things haven't changed much then! Now for the others......
The Ford "Pop" in the background says 1938 surely? That's John Siddall with Dickie Green. My first thought was that it was Lands End itself, but Messrs May & Green were teamed with E.H.Goodenough that day, all in PB's and the car on the right seems larger, making it a TA or Magnette. First instinct on the driver on the right is Ken Crawford, but he would be in a Cream Craker TA in 1938, so why would he pose with a different team?
Hello Michael, Good Christmas quiz as ever, I was sure of Nailsworth Ladder but nothing else on Q1, Q2 I believe shows l to r, C.A.N. May and probably 'Fido' Kerswell in the ex Cream Cracker PB JB 7521, then W.J. 'Dickie' Green with his PB NJ 9898, to the right is J.E.S.Jones with his wife Norah in their TA Cream Cracker ABL964 (the suicide passenger door is open that's why you can't see Norah's usual safety passenger sidescreen) I would agree that it's probably 1938 and likely the MCC Lands End trial.
Not at Chaos Manor at the moment so don't have my books. Two things about your ideas David. 1. The year, I thought Austen May only had his PB in 1936 2. As you can see I scrubbed out the Registration and Competition numbers. Will post the original picture tomorrow. However, the comp no's on the cars are 1, 2 & 4 which doesn't suggest the Lands End. Looks like we are getting there though.
It seems to me that Austen May’s passenger is a lady, judging by the hat. Assuming the year is 1938, the last year of knobbly tyres, Wheelspin records a very enjoyable Lands End in which he had a crack at the Team prize with Dickie Green and Eddie Goodenough. They ran in order throughout the event and the cars seem to be pictured in running order, from the contemporary reports quoted in the book. So, my guess is that the individuals are, from the left, Austen May, Joan May, Dickie Green, John Siddall, Eddy Goodenough and his sister Mary.
If this is correct, May records that his wife persuaded him to swap his noisy straight cut crown wheel & pinion for a spiral bevel one to keep the noise level down. This failed on the next trial, and was probably deteriorating in the Lands End….
I don't think we have got the driver of JB 7524 yet or the event. The single digit Competition numbers would rule out an MCC Trial. I did think about Blackpool or Torquay Rallies but two of the cars have "comp" tyres on the front. I reckon Simon is right, the Pop dates it as 1938 when the 7Y and 7W were available and the last year May trialled his PB.
Now we know that its JB7524, we can be fairly sure that the driver is John Haesendock, who bought his car at the same time as May. (Whelspin P102 if the anoraks want confirmation...)
Have a look at Wheelspin page 104, last para. 1937 Blackpool Rally could be the answer, it did have trials sections as well as special tests. May says he teamed up with Green and Haesendonk but he mentions that his 'Lady' passenger decided to stay at home so after a last minute scramble he secured Norman Terry as passenger, so perhaps not, and I'm not entirely happy that's a Blackpool prom shelter in the background either, not ornate enough. Of course May, green, and Haesendonck formed a team throughout the 1937/8 seasons so could it perhaps be the 1938 Great West MC Bournmouth Trial?
I don't think it is the Blackpool Rally, because (1) unless Norman Terry has some very strange ideas about headgear, that's Mrs M in the passenger seat. (2) Autumn of 1937 is too early for the Ford in the background. The clue is definately the little hut in the background. I'm sure I've seen it in other photos, but cannot think where.
Going back to using the Pop to date the picture. Searching through my old Ford books I see that the 10HP 7W (replacing the CX) was produced from March 1937 and the 8HP 7Y (replacing the Model Y) was produced from October 1937. As the car in the picture is a 2 door it could be a 7Y or a 7W. So our picture could be any time after April 1937!
Might this photo be at Virginia Water after the Lawrence Cup May 29th 1937? Again Wheelspin p 101 - 104. May won the Lawrence Cup, Green was runner up, Haesendonck got a 3rd class award. I'm not too familiar with Virginia Water Lake but that certainly looks as if it could be a lake in the background with low lying rolling ground beyond, and the small building(s) are of the type often associated with ornamental lakes/gardens
My guess without looking through the results would have been the Mid Surrey A.C. Experts Trial which started and finished around Dunster but the North West London M.C. Lawrence Cup Trial might be the one? One of the MG group must be able to confirm I've seen the photo before but can't place it 100%, tough one!
Josh is absolutely right about 'Wheelspin' I'm sure that reading it has been the inspiration for most of us who took up Classic Trialling as our principle form of motorsport. I read the book back in the early sixties whilst living in the Northwest. Very few of us Lakelanders could afford to take part in MCC trials back then but the passion to have a go remained with me ever after reading CAN May's book and when I moved down to the south midlands in the late seventies I was finally able to compete, the rest is history as they say. You should follow Michael's advice and look out for 'More Wheelspin', and then 'Wheelspin Abroad' , that book will make you long for an Allard in the Alps before everything was tarmaced over!
Steadily. Have two targets for 2010. Castle Coombe 60th anniversary (because my HRG was the first car entered in the first ever BMC&LCC car race there)
HRG 75th anniversary since production started. Must get busy.
I think the car on the left of the picture is the ex works Cream Cracker MG and the driver and owner is C.A.N May. The car in the middle is a P type MG, reg number MJ 9898?, and the driver is Dickie Green. Is the car on the right one of the NE Musketeers? When and where I don't know, by the sea maybe?
ReplyDeleteI have no idea about the answers but look at those tyres, they would go well on my Dellow!
ReplyDeleteFalmouth ? But more likely Sidmouth.
ReplyDeleteJon - The car in the middle is indeed Dickie Green's MG PB MJ 9898. This car was supercharged with a Marshall 75 Blower and according to my research did over 100 events and "apart from the accepted trials breakages such as half shafts, differentials, etc., was superb". Things haven't changed much then! Now for the others......
ReplyDeleteJon - You are right about Austen May as well, which I reckon places the picture as taken in 1936
ReplyDeleteThe Ford "Pop" in the background says 1938 surely?
ReplyDeleteThat's John Siddall with Dickie Green. My first thought was that it was Lands End itself, but Messrs May & Green were teamed with E.H.Goodenough that day, all in PB's and the car on the right seems larger, making it a TA or Magnette. First instinct on the driver on the right is Ken Crawford, but he would be in a Cream Craker TA in 1938, so why would he pose with a different team?
Didn't spot the Pop. back to the books....
ReplyDeleteHello Michael, Good Christmas quiz as ever, I was sure of Nailsworth Ladder but nothing else on Q1, Q2 I believe shows l to r, C.A.N. May and probably 'Fido' Kerswell in the ex Cream Cracker PB JB 7521, then W.J. 'Dickie' Green with his PB NJ 9898, to the right is J.E.S.Jones with his wife Norah in their TA Cream Cracker ABL964 (the suicide passenger door is open that's why you can't see Norah's usual safety passenger sidescreen) I would agree that it's probably 1938 and likely the MCC Lands End trial.
ReplyDeleteNot at Chaos Manor at the moment so don't have my books. Two things about your ideas David. 1. The year, I thought Austen May only had his PB in 1936 2. As you can see I scrubbed out the Registration and Competition numbers. Will post the original picture tomorrow. However, the comp no's on the cars are 1, 2 & 4 which doesn't suggest the Lands End. Looks like we are getting there though.
ReplyDeleteFrom John Hammill
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me that Austen May’s passenger is a lady, judging by the hat. Assuming the year is 1938, the last year of knobbly tyres, Wheelspin records a very enjoyable Lands End in which he had a crack at the Team prize with Dickie Green and Eddie Goodenough. They ran in order throughout the event and the cars seem to be pictured in running order, from the contemporary reports quoted in the book. So, my guess is that the individuals are, from the left, Austen May, Joan May, Dickie Green, John Siddall, Eddy Goodenough and his sister Mary.
If this is correct, May records that his wife persuaded him to swap his noisy straight cut crown wheel & pinion for a spiral bevel one to keep the noise level down. This failed on the next trial, and was probably deteriorating in the Lands End….
ReplyDeleteThis is the picture with the Registration and Competition Numbers. You can get a bigger version here http://classicalgas.smugmug.com/Motor-Sport-2009/2009-Christmas-Quiz/cream-cracker/750594853_SiZWm-X3.jpg
I don't think we have got the driver of JB 7524 yet or the event. The single digit Competition numbers would rule out an MCC Trial. I did think about Blackpool or Torquay Rallies but two of the cars have "comp" tyres on the front. I reckon Simon is right, the Pop dates it as 1938 when the 7Y and 7W were available and the last year May trialled his PB.
ReplyDeleteNow we know that its JB7524, we can be fairly sure that the driver is John Haesendock, who bought his car at the same time as May. (Whelspin P102 if the anoraks want confirmation...)
ReplyDeleteHave a look at Wheelspin page 104, last para. 1937 Blackpool Rally could be the answer, it did have trials sections as well as special tests. May says he teamed up with Green and Haesendonk but he mentions that his 'Lady' passenger decided to stay at home so after a last minute scramble he secured Norman Terry as passenger, so perhaps not, and I'm not entirely happy that's a Blackpool prom shelter in the background either, not ornate enough. Of course May, green, and Haesendonck formed a team throughout the 1937/8 seasons so could it perhaps be the 1938 Great West MC Bournmouth Trial?
ReplyDeleteI don't think it is the Blackpool Rally, because (1) unless Norman Terry has some very strange ideas about headgear, that's Mrs M in the passenger seat. (2) Autumn of 1937 is too early for the Ford in the background.
ReplyDeleteThe clue is definately the little hut in the background. I'm sure I've seen it in other photos, but cannot think where.
1938 Brighton-Beer
ReplyDeleteDuring '38 Green changed from using the blown PB NJ9898 to his blown T type BJB 412.
ReplyDeletePB was used on the Exeter and Lands End, TA for Brighton-Beer on 19th June 1938. So ..... possibly .... pre-June?
Going back to using the Pop to date the picture. Searching through my old Ford books I see that the 10HP 7W (replacing the CX) was produced from March 1937 and the 8HP 7Y (replacing the Model Y) was produced from October 1937. As the car in the picture is a 2 door it could be a 7Y or a 7W. So our picture could be any time after April 1937!
ReplyDeleteMight this photo be at Virginia Water after the Lawrence Cup May 29th 1937? Again Wheelspin p 101 - 104. May won the Lawrence Cup, Green was runner up, Haesendonck got a 3rd class award. I'm not too familiar with Virginia Water Lake but that certainly looks as if it could be a lake in the background with low lying rolling ground beyond, and the small building(s) are of the type often associated with ornamental lakes/gardens
ReplyDeleteI think the wheelspin book is to be thanked for this, im just finishing reading it, very good.
ReplyDeleteMy guess without looking through the results would have been the Mid Surrey A.C. Experts Trial which started and finished around Dunster but the North West London M.C. Lawrence Cup Trial might be the one? One of the MG group must be able to confirm I've seen the photo before but can't place it 100%, tough one!
ReplyDeleteHave you got More Wheelspin as well Josh? IMHO its an even better read. He has more power!
ReplyDeleteJosh is absolutely right about 'Wheelspin' I'm sure that reading it has been the inspiration for most of us who took up Classic Trialling as our principle form of motorsport. I read the book back in the early sixties whilst living in the Northwest. Very few of us Lakelanders could afford to take part in MCC trials back then but the passion to have a go remained with me ever after reading CAN May's book and when I moved down to the south midlands in the late seventies I was finally able to compete, the rest is history as they say. You should follow Michael's advice and look out for 'More Wheelspin', and then 'Wheelspin Abroad' , that book will make you long for an Allard in the Alps before everything was tarmaced over!
ReplyDeleteMore Wheelspin is on the shelf ready to be read.
ReplyDeleteBoth 'Wheelspin' and 'Morre Wheelspin' have been available on Amazon. More Wheelspin was reprinted a few years ago.
ReplyDeleteJosh. I'll ask Bill Holt to give you a ride in my old Allard sometime in the New Year. That will really wet your appetite........
ReplyDeleteThat would be very kind Nigel, Hows the HRG coming on.
ReplyDeleteSteadily. Have two targets for 2010.
ReplyDeleteCastle Coombe 60th anniversary (because my HRG was the first car entered in the first ever BMC&LCC car race there)
HRG 75th anniversary since production started. Must get busy.